Routes and Waypoints

For everything Garmin Zumo 590/595 related
sussamb
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Re: Routes and Waypoints

Post by sussamb »

I suspect the problem here is nomenclature so when someone says this transfers others think well not for me :)

Garmin uses a mixture of names, as do users, but the normally accepted way is that a basic route consists of a start and finish. Users can add to that additional points; shaping points, that are not announced and can be easily skipped without intervention, and viapoints, which are announced and which must be driven through unless the user takes some action to avoid them. Note earlier devices won't accept shaping points from BaseCamp, and converts them to viapoints. None of these points, start, finish, shaping and via points, will appear in favourites/saved places when you transfer a route.

The wrinkle is if you create a waypoint in BaseCamp and add that specifically to a route, that waypoint will appear in favourites/saved places.

adl55
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Re: Routes and Waypoints

Post by adl55 »

sussamb wrote:
13 Jun 2019 15:11
I suspect the problem here is nomenclature so when someone says this transfers others think well not for me :)

Garmin uses a mixture of names, as do users, but the normally accepted way is that a basic route consists of a start and finish. Users can add to that additional points; shaping points, that are not announced and can be easily skipped without intervention, and viapoints, which are announced and which must be driven through unless the user takes some action to avoid them. Note earlier devices won't accept shaping points from BaseCamp, and converts them to viapoints. None of these points, start, finish, shaping and via points, will appear in favourites/saved places when you transfer a route.
Agree completely. And add the comment that Garmin has been "less than consistent" in differentiating shaping points, viapoints and waypoints. Users have been worse.
sussamb wrote:
13 Jun 2019 15:11
The wrinkle is if you create a waypoint in BaseCamp and add that specifically to a route, that waypoint will appear in favourites/saved places.
NOPE!

Does NOT happen for me. I have specifically used Basecamp-created "waypoints"as both shaping points and destinations in routes, drag-n-dropped those routes to "User Data" on the SD card inside the 595 (an SD card specific for next week's trip as rbentnail suggested) then imported those routes. Those Basecamp "waypoints" did NOT appear in my favorites/saved places. (That's why I resorted to messing with the Current.GPX file to hammer those "waypoints" into the 595.)

But I'll try it again later today and report back. If it works, including "extra" Basecamp-created "waypoints" in routes could be used to "sneak" them into favorites/saved places before deleting them from the imported routes. One way or another, I can get the 595 to hold the User Data for my trip. Hopefully it won't require using a hammer.

sussamb
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Re: Routes and Waypoints

Post by sussamb »

If they're not appearing just select them along with the route and send the lot to your zumo.

adl55
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Re: Routes and Waypoints

Post by adl55 »

sussamb wrote:
13 Jun 2019 15:46
If they're not appearing just select them along with the route and send the lot to your zumo.
Did that. Didn't work. 595 is next to my PC right now. I'll be firing up Basecamp and trying it again.

What you recommend, btw, works just fine on a Zumo 660. But saved locations works differently on that device.

adl55
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Re: Routes and Waypoints

Post by adl55 »

Experimenting is done. Hope I can explain clearly.

Basic/background data:
o Zumo 595
o firmware = 4.60
o mapset = Full coverage of North America 2020.10
o 38 local favorites/waypoints were previously sent from Basecamp to internal storage
o 12 routes and 15 favorites/waypoints for an upcoming trip were sent from Basecamp to the memory card
- 2 of the routes were imported using the Trip Planner app
- 5 of the 15 favorites/waypoints are NOT contained in any of the routes.
- No way to access these 15 favorites/waypoints through the Zumo 595's software has been found.

Windows Explorer showed:
o Internal storage - GPX directory held 4 files
- Current.gpx contianing 38 favorites/waypoints (None having Basecamp symbols.) sent from Basecamp, 1 favorite/waypoint with coordinates of current location and the routes previously imported.
- CurrentTrackLog.gpx containing 9 tracks of local driving over the last 4 days.
- Position.gpx containing the favorite/waypoint with coordinates of current location
- temp.gpx containing the same favorites/waypoints as Current.gpx. (35 of the 38 sent from Basecamp have Basecamp symbols.)
o Memory card - \Garmin\GPX directory held 13 files
- Route.gpx and Route1.gpx through Route10.gpx each contain one of the twelve routes sent from Basecamp
- Waypoints.gpx contains all of the favorites/waypoints sent from Basecamp

The first test was using Basecamp to send routes directly to internal storage
o Routes were added into temp.gpx
o Favorites/waypoints within those routes were also added to temp.gpx.
o The Zumo 595 powered down upon being disconnected from the PC.
o Upon power up, the Zumo 595 asked if the routes should be imported.
o Affirmative response initiated the import routine.
o All favorites/waypoints contained within the imported routes were added to the 39 mentioned above.
o Windows Explorer revealed that internal memory contained all imported routes inside Current.gpx.

The second test was using Basecamp to send favorites/waypoints directly to internal storage after manually deleting them from the Zumo 595.
o All were added to temp.gpx with Basecamp symbols.
o The Zumo 595 powered down upon being disconnected from the PC.
o After power up the favorites/waypoints* sent from Basecamp were added to the 39 mentioned above.
o Reconnecting to the PC showed the "new" favorites/waypoints were in Current.gpx as well as temp.gpx.

* Excluding favorites/waypoints contained in previously imported routes.

The third test was using Basecamp to send favorites/waypoints to internal storage and routes to the memory card after manually deleting all routes and trip favorites/waypoints from the Zumo 595. Windows Explorer was used to delete the files on the memory card.
o "Trip" favorites/waypoints are those mentioned above, 10 contained within routes and 5 additional spots near the destination.
o 38 local favorites/waypoints were left on the Zump 595.
o 1 favorite/waypoint with coordinate of the current location was left on the Zumo 595.
Results:
o 15 favorites/waypoints were added to the Zumo 595 and available in saved places.
o 12 routes were on the memory card and available to be imported.

Conclusions:
o Sending Basecamp routes and favorites/waypoints to internal storage on the Zumo 595 works as susamb expects.
o Sending them to the memory card does not.
o rbentnail's recommendation of storing routes on different memory cards for different trips works well by providing a library of routes that can be accessed as needed. Imported routes WILL be stored within internal memory until manually purged from the Zumo 595.
- Favorites/waypoints that will be needed for anything other than navigating routes should be sent to internal memory from Basecamp.
- Favorites/waypoints that will be needed for anything IN ADDITION TO navigating routes should be sent to internal memory from Basecamp BEFORE ROUTES ARE IMPORTED. (i.e. Favorites/waypoints that are contained in routes need to be sent to internal memory before the routes are imported or they won't be among the saved locations.)
- This is more cumbersome than sending routes and favorites/waypoints directly to internal storage from Basecamp but permits storing "extra" routes on the memory card that will be available if needed but otherwise out of the way.

sussamb
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Re: Routes and Waypoints

Post by sussamb »

Nice write up that I'm sure will help others. I've never tried sending waypoints to a card on a 595 but surprised that doesn't work, it does on other devices that I've used, just goes to show what works on some fails on others :)

jfheath
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Re: Routes and Waypoints

Post by jfheath »

sussamb wrote:
13 Jun 2019 15:11
Garmin uses a mixture of names, as do users, but the normally accepted way is that a basic route consists of a start and finish. Users can add to that additional points; shaping points, that are not announced and can be easily skipped without intervention, and viapoints, which are announced and which must be driven through unless the user takes some action to avoid them. Note earlier devices won't accept shaping points from BaseCamp, and converts them to viapoints. None of these points, start, finish, shaping and via points, will appear in favourites/saved places when you transfer a route.

The wrinkle is if you create a waypoint in BaseCamp and add that specifically to a route, that waypoint will appear in favourites/saved places.
@sussamb's comment is spot on, and applies equally to the 590 and the 595.

Favourites on the Zumo equates to Waypoints in Basecamp. Waypoints are the stored points or points made with the Waypoint flag tool in Basecamp. Waypoints have the capacity to store additional information including phone number and address. Don't confuse a Waypoint with a normal point in a route - they are not the same thing. You can transfer Waypoints to the Zumo without them forming part of a route - they can be there in the list of Favourites just as Points of Interest, which might be useful while you are out and about.

However, the information below adds extra detail to @sussamb's scenario and answers @adl55's issue of the Waypoints not appearing in the list of favourites on the Zumo. :

If transferring routes and / or Waypoints to the internal memory.
  • Any Waypoints which are transferred as separate items, or which form part of a route will appear in the list of favourites. They are available without importing the route or the favourites.
  • There is No need to transfer Waypoints separately if they form a part of the route.
If transferring routes and / or Waypoints to the SD Card
  • Any Waypoints that have been transferred to the Zumo as part of a route, will not appear until the route has been imported.
  • The same applies to individual Waypoints - they need to be imported before they become visible.
And here as an even bigger wrinkle.
  • No Waypoints will EVER appear in the list of favourites on the Zumo 590 or 595 if you have stored the routes or Waypoints on the SD Card.
UNLESS
  • You transfer at least one Waypoint to the internal memory (either an individual point, or a Waypoint that has been built into a route that is stored in internal memory).
  • As soon as you transfer a Waypoint to internal memory, the Waypoints that are on the SD card become available for import.
And this would be why the appearance of Waypoints in the list of Zumo's favourites has appears to be random. It would seem that the software only looks to the SD card if it has already found Waypoint in internal memory.

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