Shaping points enigma

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AaroninNY
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Joined: 19 Jun 2020 22:27
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Shaping points enigma

Post by AaroninNY »

Hi everyone, first many thanks for maintaining this forum. This is my first post here.

I'm writing with a problem that I hope folks can help with. I'm the type of person who loves to spend hours painstakingly planning an exact turn-by-turn route. I greatly appreciate the use of shaping points in this endeavor.

I've had the Garmin Zumo 595LM for two years now and been frustrated because it seems as if the Zumo very seldom keeps to the directions I've so carefully planned out. I think I've finally determined the problem: the Zumo treats my shaping points as if they don't exist. If I plan a route with a start point, an end point, and say, 19 shaping points, the unit will ignore the 19 points and try to route me on the direct course to the endpoint. Does this happen with anyone else? Is there a way to get my Zumo to adhere to the shaping points? My workaround is to avoid using shaping points and just use waypoints that are announced. The drawback with that is there are all these waypoints being announced that I just have to ignore, which clutters up the directions (not to mention defeats the purpose of having shaping points).

Making things more frustrating, when reviewing the map on the Zumo before starting, the overall map usually looks perfect - exactly as I'd planned it out on basecamp. Only after turning on the navigation does the Zumo reroute me away from my planned route.

Does this happen to anyone else? I've played around with the settings on basecamp and on the unit itself under options > activity profile > routing > route preference (trying both "faster time" and "shorter distance") but this doesn't seem to resolve the issue.

One related issue may be that whenever I upload a route I get this error message: "Route(s) sent to zumo 595 were recalculated because they was (sic) created on a map that is not installed on that device." Could that be the reason? I doubt it, because it seems unlikely that there are that many changes of significance from one updated to the next, AND because like I said the map does appear to look perfect when it's being displayed first before navigation starts.

Any help is MOST, most appreciated. Thanks everyone for listening to my long-winded explanation here.
Aaron D., the Bronx, N.Y.
Garmin Zumo 595 LM
2020 Kawasaki W800 & 2015 Yamaha V Star 650 Custom

rbentnail
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Re: Shaping points enigma

Post by rbentnail »

It's not just you! I'm having a hard time with it too, have been for 2+ yrs. Especially the "Making things more frustrating, when reviewing the map on the Zumo before starting, the overall map usually looks perfect - exactly as I'd planned it out on basecamp. Only after turning on the navigation does the Zumo reroute me away from my planned route." part, I get the feeling that people think I'm full of it when I tell them pressing MAP to preview and Go/START to navigate results in 2 different routes.

Yes, different maps will confuse the zumo. I found that out too. I use Base Camp so the maps on the laptop and the zumo are the same. Update your Base Camp and zumo with the same maps. Make sure the Activity Profile (Driving, Motorcycling) are the same in both BC and the zumo. I NEVER use motorcycling, that's a whole 'nother barrel of worms.
Russ B. Zumo 595,
2007 USA Yamaha FJR1300A, 133k and counting

MSTOCK27370
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Re: Shaping points enigma

Post by MSTOCK27370 »

AaroninNY - Check the Options setting in BaseCamp (Edit - Options - Device Transfer). Make sure that the setting, Strip shaping points from routes on transfer to device, is NOT CHECKED. As it says, if you check this box, the shaping points are removed from the route when it is sent to the GPS.

Michael
Trinity, NC
Zumo 590, 450, 550
Michael S.
Trinity, North Carolina
Zumo 590LM, 450, 550 BMW R1100RT, R100, R60/6

sussamb
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Re: Shaping points enigma

Post by sussamb »

One thing that also causes this issue is that when you hit Go and you see a selection of points to select, which would be the start and the end of your route if the rest are shaping points, you need to select the start and not the end point.

AaroninNY
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Joined: 19 Jun 2020 22:27
United States of America

Re: Shaping points enigma

Post by AaroninNY »

Many thanks everyone. I appreciate it all, because it makes me realize this is something in the settings that can be fixed, not some built-in unsolvable flaw in the system.

Russ - thanks. I'm updating the maps in BaseCamp now to match what was on the Zumo, thanks to this helpful tutorial from YouTube. The basecamp had been using City Navigator North America NT 2020.2 and the Zumo had been using City Navigator North America NT 2021.1. I can't imagine they were that terribly different from each other but I'm glad to be able to get them identical, which should help eliminate any weirdness and if nothing else will stop that error message from popping up whenever I send to device. My basecamp activity profile is motorcycling and my Zumo user mode is motorcycling. My zumo calculation mode is shorter distance and my basecamp route preference is also shorter distance. (Only because using shorter distance seems to gives me finer grain control when trying to plan a precise route. There are certainly times when I prefer to shift to "faster time" for more utilitarian navigation.)

Michael - thanks as well. I hadn't been aware of that setting, and it seems pretty crucial to this. I found it and discovered it had already been unchecked. I'll make sure it stays that way, which certainly should help.

Sussam - this might actually be my main problem. I've always been sort of baffled by that prompt. I can't figure out why it is being asked. For one thing, I always start my routes while I'm sitting right at the start point, so it should be kind of obvious to the device that I don't want to navigate to where I already am. And second, when one plans out a route, it's planned out with a certain direction in mind. You start at the first point which is listed at the top, and end at the last point. The midpoints (whether shaping points or regular announced waypoints) are ordered in a specific order on the screen. The device should "know" which order you want to go in. Third, routes don't really seem reversible. For example if you accidentally click a few pixels away from your intended point, say in the northbound lanes of a divided highway instead of the southbound lanes, the system will route you into a U-turn, so even it "knows" which way you're trying to go.

So, just to recap this. Let's say I have two points, my garage where I am starting, and some distant point (plus a number of intermediate shaping points). If I am sitting in front of my garage and I click on "Go!" I will see a screen that asks: "Select Next Destination." It ignores the shaping points and shows just two points: a green flag which is my garage where I am now, and a checkered flag which is my destination. What I should click on as my "next destination" is actually my current location, with the green flag. Is that right? I think I've probably been clicking on the distant point an maybe that's what has been screwing this up.

Questions:
1) Does this change if your end point is the geographically same point as your start point? (Because I've planned a loop route?)
2) What if I have a few shaping points but also a few announced waypoints. In that case, the "Select Next Destination" screen shows more than two options. A green flag where I am now starting, intermediate points, and a the checkered final destination. Do I still click on the green-flag start point?

OK this got longer than I thought it would. Once again, thank you everyone who responded. Ahh technology. It does what you want, but only if everything is lined up just. exactly. perfect.
Aaron D., the Bronx, N.Y.
Garmin Zumo 595 LM
2020 Kawasaki W800 & 2015 Yamaha V Star 650 Custom

sussamb
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Re: Shaping points enigma

Post by sussamb »

Whatever the number of waypoints your device will calculate it's own route to the one you select then follow your planned route from there. I tend to have my start point a few hundred metres from where I'm starting. Therefore if you select the end point your route will be completely ignored. Any other point that you select once you reach that point your device will follow your planned route including shaping points. Any shaping points, if any, before the point you select will be ignored.

yorky
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Re: Shaping points enigma

Post by yorky »

Ditto to what Sussamb has just said.
I have received lots of helpful information from JFHeath. one was to put a Via (announced) point a couple of miles from your start point. The Zumo will find it's own way to that point and thereafter follow all shaping points.

AaroninNY
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United States of America

Re: Shaping points enigma

Post by AaroninNY »

Sussam, Yorky, many thanks here. Knowing that one key piece of information (that the zumo finds its own way to the first point then should exactly follow your route thereafter) I think will put me on the right track here. I'll reconfigure my starts accordingly and I'm looking forward to putting this to the test. -Aaron
Aaron D., the Bronx, N.Y.
Garmin Zumo 595 LM
2020 Kawasaki W800 & 2015 Yamaha V Star 650 Custom

Iris
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Re: Shaping points enigma

Post by Iris »

I didn’t read through all the responses but make sure that your ZUMO says “ready to navigate” before you activate your route.
I have had the same issue and I realized that I just needed to wait until the Zumo has located satellites.


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Iris
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Re: Shaping points enigma

Post by Iris »

AaroninNY wrote:
So, just to recap this. Let's say I have two points, my garage where I am starting, and some distant point (plus a number of intermediate shaping points). If I am sitting in front of my garage and I click on "Go!" I will see a screen that asks: "Select Next Destination." It ignores the shaping points and shows just two points: a green flag which is my garage where I am now, and a checkered flag which is my destination. What I should click on as my "next destination" is actually my current location, with the green flag. Is that right? I think I've probably been clicking on the distant point an maybe that's what has been screwing this up.
Yes. Click on the first point. In the above example it is your garage.

I actually use a point a small distance from my house (100 or so feet in the direction that I am traveling when I leave my house. I call that point “Home Start”.
I create another point called “Home Finish”. That one is placed away from the start point, in a location that I know I will pass over just before I get home.
I make these two points because if I do a loop back to my start point, the gps didn’t seem to like that the beginning was also the end.


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