ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

For help and advice on the Garmin Zumo XT2.
jfheath
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Re: ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

Post by jfheath »

Yes - it is maddening. But now we think we have the RUT behaviour pinned down, I find that the XT very quickly recognises the way that I am going as being the route to take.

Subsequent to the 'fix' that @FrankB identified and the alternative 'on the go' fix of using the trip planner to save the active route using the XT screen - I have been slowly ticking off my various test routes to see what happens when previously the XT got stuck in the RUT loop.

In a lot of cases, as soon as I deviated - the point where previousy the RUT behaviour would be triggered - the XT would recalculate the route in the way that I was heading. In some cases it made a few requests to U turn - but that was reasonable - I was taking a much longer route - and then it started to navigate ahead.

I did some 'balance point' tests. Found the point on the road that I was going to take (but for which the XT would calculate a route using 'faster' roads).
I under simualtion, I placed the bike half way along the route I would be taking - to see which way the XT would route me. Then I'd move it forward or back to find the place where if I place my bike one side of the location, it would route me one way, and if I placed it the other side, it would route me the other way.

Then I went and rode the route. In every one of my tests the XT recalculated the route ahead - ie in the direction that I was riding - long before it reached the point that I had identified as being the balance point. A good many miles in some cases. Casual observation was that as soon as the last option to turn off to use a faster road had been ignored, it started navigating ahead. Even though according to the previous desktop tests, it would be preferred to go int he opposite direction. Which is much, much better than the 590 or 595 ever did.

On the one location where I first pinned down the behaviour and spent a couple of hours loading test routes and riding back and forth to see what would happen the XT didn't miss a beat when I turned the wrong way. It recalcuated the route in the way that I was heading.

So on a 'fixed' route the parallel motorway issue should not be an issue for very long - it will try to take you back to start with, but if my observations repeat themselves, the XT is behaving much better than I ever expected it to in calculating the way ahead.
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Re: ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

Post by Peobody »

jfheath wrote: 17 Sep 2023 13:39 So on a 'fixed' route the parallel motorway issue should not be an issue for very long - it will try to take you back to start with, but if my observations repeat themselves, the XT is behaving much better than I ever expected it to in calculating the way ahead.
Just so that I'm clear, are you saying that a 'fixed' route (eg: 'saved' trip) not only eliminates the RUT issue but also reduces the insistence by the XT of routing on faster parallel roads even if longer distance?

If so, this is fascinating in that the logic used for recalculating a 'fixed' route is dramatically changed regarding emphasis on faster roads.
Was the route calculated on the secondary road or did you have to ride through a u-turn point before it calculated forward on the secondary road? If the later, then based in my current thinking of the XT logic it would route you back to the faster road at the next access point unless there is a route point on the secondary road that is beyond that access point, likely needing to be placed midway before the next access point.
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Re: ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

Post by jfheath »

Peobody wrote: 17 Sep 2023 13:59
Just so that I'm clear, are you saying that a 'fixed' route (eg: 'saved' trip) not only eliminates the RUT issue but also reduces the insistence by the XT of routing on faster parallel roads even if longer distance?
No. I'm saying that what I have observed is that even though the XT is heading for its faster route, if I choose to go my own way, the XT gives up on insisiting that I take its route - much sooner than I expected it to.

Given its algorithm of heading for faster roads, demanding a U turn is perfectly sensible and correct. Yet my observations are that it gives up quite a long way before reaching the point where my way is to be preferred. It is as if continuing to navigate in the way that I am heading is given a much greater weight than I expected.

Let me illustrate. I have to say this first though: Map Contains OS data © Crown copyright 2020
Click to get a better image

OS Map.jpg
OS Map.jpg (386.44 KiB) Viewed 1162 times

I was taking the red line.

All the way down, the XT was taking every opportunity to get me to take the motorway - the A1(M) and then the M62 East.
At no point on this run did it ask me to turn round and go back when I carried on my red line.
But it still wanted to take me SW to junction 43 from Towton, WSW on the yellow road from Sherburn, South at the Green Triangle on the A162 to join the A1(M)
As soon as I turned East on the A63 at the green traingle, it gave up and navigated me east.
Yet I know that if I stop at the side of the road and ask it to take me to the same destination (which is 5 miles due south of the letter 'E' in Knottingley at the bottom of this map), the XT will want to head me west to the green triangle.

The balance point here is the yellow triangle - a village called Hambleton. If I set my destination when I am at the east side of the village, it heads me east. If I set me destination when I am parked on the west side of the village, it heads me west.

Yet - having just passed the green triangle, it has already given up on the motoways and is taking me east. 4 miles before the yellow triangle balance point.

I've seen similar behaviour in other places - but this particular section I had tested throughly when it was displaying RUT behaviour - and this result really surprised me - I had decided that I knew what it was going to do. I was wrong - in a good way. I had to check that I hadn't disabled U turns. No - they were allowed. It didn't use them.
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Re: ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

Post by Peobody »

jfheath wrote: 17 Sep 2023 15:31 No. I'm saying that what I have observed is that even though the XT is heading for its faster route, if I choose to go my own way, the XT gives up on insisiting that I take its route - much sooner than I expected it to.
This clarifies it for me. Thanks!
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Re: ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

Post by jfheath »

Is there any further information on how the XT2 behaved on a long trip (@Malarkey @technoguppy) ?

I'm curious to know whether or not the RUT issue still exists on the XT2. If anyone out there with an XT2 would like to perform a test - I can give you instructions on how to make it happen.
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Re: ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

Post by technoguppy »

Upon removing Tread App from my phone (and my wife's phone) and solely using BaseCamp routes imported to the units, it worked perfectly.

There are still some idiosyncrasies with the device (auto reroute, detours, some common events for motorcyclists like route planning a day trip that starts and ends at the same location) but following the preprogrammed route from BaseCamp is not a issue so long as there is NO interference from the Tread App.

If for whatever reason we leave the scheduled route for a detour or other event, once we are back on it, it picks up without issue. Further to that, I can insert another destination as a middle point or as an endpoint, without issue.

These are my experiences as witnessed on my device and my wife's (who follows) device.
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Re: ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

Post by jfheath »

Thanks @technoguppy . It's good to hear positive comments about the XT2.
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Re: ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

Post by Malarkey »

Yep I agree, once you stop using the app it seems to work OK with a few Garmin gremlins still in there.

I have found its better not to let it re route if you go off your route too or it can send it into a bit of a tailspin, I tried restarting the route with nearest entry too on one trip and it said it couldn't find a way to get back onto it so I had to improvise and eventually got there.
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Re: ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

Post by jfheath »

Malarkey wrote: 13 Nov 2023 22:55 Yep I agree, once you stop using the app it seems to work OK with a few Garmin gremlins still in there.

I have found its better not to let it re route if you go off your route too or it can send it into a bit of tailspin.
That sounds familiar. If you know when it does this - try this.

Load the route in question and select Go! Then back to the main screen and select Route Planner (I think thats what it is in the XT2) and select the active route and save it with a new name.

Then go and ride the new route with recalc enabled. When you start the route - you may note that it appears under 'Saved Routes' - You will also notice that there is a new start point. The original start point is second in the list. When asked to select next destination. Select the first and then before setting off, Skip either the first start point or the original start point. On the XT that is one of the things that triggers that behaviour later when you deviate.

See if it behaves sensibly when you deviate. I would be very interested to know whether or not it does.

I haven't got an XT2 so the above may not be possible, or the words may have changed on the XT2, but it fixes all sorts of route issues on the XT.
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Re: ZUMO XT2 CONCLUSIONS

Post by Malarkey »

That's interesting - I'll try that next time I run a route - might be a while with the current weather though!

The "Skip" option no longer has a dedicated button that I can see on the XT2 but you can go into Edit route and choose to skip there by the look of it - I've not tried doing that but will do.

I think I probably need to really fully read and understand the manual, it should be fairly intuitive to use having had the last 4 versions of the Zumo but there's a lot that's changed.

I'm not sure if I had already put this but the routes I planned for 12 day trip in Austria in September seemed to work really well - My friend kept his 595 and they seemed to follow pretty true to what was planned so they do work well, I guess a lot has to do with the information you put in in the first place as usual.

Sharing in this forum is great though, I've learnt a lot so far.
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