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Re: A long, single, multi-day route.
Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2025 2:29 am
by Peobody
To complicate things further, Basecamp has a "Waypoint" tool. When creating a route, I will use it to place points on the roads I want travel, select them all, and then tell Basecamp to create a route from all of those Waypoints. The result will be the basis for my route. It is made up solely of Waypoints, all Via points by default but I do not intend to stop at most of them. I will eventually change the majority of them to Shaping points. My point about this is that when Basecamp is in the discussion, the reference to "Waypoints" may be associated with using the Waypoint tool to create route points.
Re: A long, single, multi-day route.
Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2025 6:57 am
by jfheath
Far from complicating - that makes it easier to understand. Thank you.
A couple of years ago I set myself a challenge - trying to get some simple points across in a series of videos each of which were between 2-3 minutes long. They are posted here. #5 and 6 are to do with creating Garmin's waypoints and then building a route from them. No big explanations - just basic info.
https://www.zumouserforums.co.uk/viewto ... 145#p14145
Re: A long, single, multi-day route.
Posted: Tue Mar 11, 2025 11:37 pm
by Mikey
Just when I thought I was almost ready to successfully navigate the world with BC and my XT… but no!
Would willing Zumers please check this for me:
A. Shown or listed in Garmin BC are
- BC’s own POI,
- BC’s own WPs
B. I can create and add my own POI, these are saved.
C. I can add WPs with the flag tool.
D. I can add these WPs to my BC Route where they become either Via points or Shaping points
E. The flag tool WPs I create in BC and the ‘factory’ Garmin BC POI/WPs are equivalent in the way they are treated by my XT in my Route and on-Route when riding.
Thank you, Mikey
Re: A long, single, multi-day route.
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 12:38 am
by Peobody
Yes to all, although I don't use BC POI's in a route. Here's why... Let's use a fuel station as an example. The BC POI for it will likely have coordinates for about where the cash register is. The fuel pumps are well away from that point so if you use that POI in your route, you may not get close enough to that point to satisfy your XT that you visited it. Of course this applies many, many POIs where its coordinates is not close enough to where you will get. I should correct my "don't use" statement though. On the rare occasion when I want the POI phone number to be available I will use the BC POI as a Waypoint, but will confirm that its point is located where I am certain to ride so the XT will be satisfied that I visited it. I will move its point if needed.
When it comes to Waypoints for food and fuel, I will place them, as Via points, on the road just prior to the physical structure, trying to be within eyesight of its sign. This insures that I "visit it" even if I decide not to stop. An alternative is to place the Waypoint as a Via just beyond the physical location. This adds the convenience of it serving as an entry point in the event you had to restart the route during your stop. Heck, you could do both.
Here's another scenario, consider you want to add a Waypoint for a coffee shop that you 'might' want to stop at, but it's down a side road a few hundred yards. If you choose not to stop for coffee you don't want to be forced to ride down the side street, so you can place a route point on the road just prior to the turn, labeled something like "Turn R for Cup-O-Java". Behaviorally, it doesn't make a difference whether this is a Via or a Shaping point because you will visit it whether you stop or not. Know that if you make the turn, the XT will think you are off route. It is important that auto recalculation either be set to Off or Prompt to prevent a recalculation. This then allows you to ignore the off route notices (or respond NO if prompted). The XT will resume navigation once you return to the route.
Re: A long, single, multi-day route.
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 1:02 am
by jfheath
Garmin POI's are rather complex. They behave a bit like speed cameras and are not related to any route
They show up on a map is an image - you can make your own - and you can set a perimeter. Eg 3 miles. You can record a sound. so for a stupid example, you could, if you were so inclined, get the Zumo to play a Beatles Track as soon as you got within 3 miles of Penny Lane, in Liverpool.
I don't think that this is what you are meaning as a Point of Interest ?
I'm guessing that you mean the library of locations that are available on the right hand window in Basecamp ?
Re: A long, single, multi-day route.
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 4:46 am
by Mikey
Peobody wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 12:38 am
Yes to all, although I don't use BC POI's in a route. Here's why... Let's use a fuel station as an example. The BC POI for it will likely have coordinates for about where the cash register is. The fuel pumps are well away from that point so if you use that POI in your route, you may not get close enough to that point to satisfy your XT that you visited it. Of course this applies many, many POIs where its coordinates is not close enough to where you will get. I should correct my "don't use" statement though. On the rare occasion when I want the POI phone number to be available I will use the BC POI as a Waypoint, but will confirm that its point is located where I am certain to ride so the XT will be satisfied that I visited it. I will move its point if needed.
When it comes to Waypoints for food and fuel, I will place them, as Via points, on the road just prior to the physical structure, trying to be within eyesight of its sign. This insures that I "visit it" even if I decide not to stop. An alternative is to place the Waypoint as a Via just beyond the physical location. This adds the convenience of it serving as an entry point in the event you had to restart the route during your stop. Heck, you could do both.
Here's another scenario, consider you want to add a Waypoint for a coffee shop that you 'might' want to stop at, but it's down a side road a few hundred yards. If you choose not to stop for coffee you don't want to be forced to ride down the side street, so you can place a route point on the road just prior to the turn, labeled something like "Turn R for Cup-O-Java". Behaviorally, it doesn't make a difference whether this is a Via or a Shaping point because you will visit it whether you stop or not. Know that if you make the turn, the XT will think you are off route. It is important that auto recalculation either be set to Off or Prompt to prevent a recalculation. This then allows you to ignore the off route notices (or respond NO if prompted). The XT will resume navigation once you return to the route.
Thank you Peobody,
There are lots of practical tips here I can employ. All noted in my pocket notebook.
Much appreciated.
Cheers, Mikey
Re: A long, single, multi-day route.
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 5:01 am
by Mikey
jfheath wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 1:02 am
Garmin POI's are rather complex. They behave a bit like speed cameras and are not related to any route
They show up on a map is an image - you can make your own - and you can set a perimeter. Eg 3 miles. You can record a sound. so for a stupid example, you could, if you were so inclined, get the Zumo to play a Beatles Track as soon as you got within 3 miles of Penny Lane, in Liverpool.
I don't think that this is what you are meaning as a Point of Interest ?
I'm guessing that you mean the library of locations that are available on the right hand window in Basecamp ?
Thank you jfheath, Yes, I am referring to the BC POI in the RHS library (and shown on the map). I rarely have included them in my routes preferring to only use appropriately placed Via points and Shaping. Maybe I will see the value in the BC POIs sometime.
Thank you for your previous, detailed responses, my learning continues. I have watched all the BC Quickies a few times. The basics I note easily but the more complex bits I need to re-examine.
I am determined to become a competent BC'er and XT'er, trip planning and GPS use is something I always enjoy, so long as the GPS and I can 'get along well'.
Mikey.
Re: A long, single, multi-day route.
Posted: Wed Mar 12, 2025 7:58 am
by jfheath
Mikey wrote: ↑Wed Mar 12, 2025 5:01 am
Thank you jfheath, Yes, I am referring to the BC POI in the RHS library (and shown on the map). I rarely have included them in my routes preferring to only use appropriately placed Via points and Shaping. Maybe I will see the value in the BC POIs sometime.
I sometimes use Garmin's database - but I always check them - phone numbers may have changed and locations are not very accurate.
I found this when plotting routes using the Parador hotels in Spain. Literally miles out in some cases.
It is a good way of getting a rough route in the early stages of planning. It has a name and a symbol and you know it is around there somewhere. So it will do for now, but I use Google street view and satellite images to find where I need to get the bike to where I will dismount. Then move the point to there.