Latest XT2/Tread software version

[jfheath]

I think that is the first time I have reported anything, and it has been fixed.

Just curious. Did they give you more info? (You being the reporter)

No, not yet. They say when they accept an issue, that it will take some time but they will inform me of the outcome. That has been repeated when I have chased up issues which still exist.

That has never happened. I will follow this up with them as soon as I have checked out ‘normal Poi behaviour’ - ie just POIs without the additional tour-guide alert features.

[TheoTiger]

I tested a few things. The speed camera files work best when Garmin Cyclops is disabled. If you don’t disable it, the Cyclops warning appears on the screen and your own custom alert is barely visible. When Garmin Cyclops is turned off, the location is shown on the screen and you hear a sound before you reach the point. It’s also possible to add your own sound, but for each speed camera the name must be identical.

[proofresistant]

Don't get too enthusiastic too quickly about fixed synchronization problems.
Even with the new SW updates, I, at least, have continued to experience significant synchronization issues.
I am using now:
zumo XT2 Version 6.40
Tread App Version 2.12.40

Sometimes, the zumo XT2 and the Tread App get stuck in countless synchronization loops
Just as observed previously

[turbo19]

Don't get too enthusiastic too quickly about fixed synchronization problems.
Even with the new SW updates, I, at least, have continued to experience significant synchronization issues.
I am using now:
zumo XT2 Version 6.40
Tread App Version 2.12.40

Sometimes, the zumo XT2 and the Tread App get stuck in countless synchronization loops
Just as observed previously

You're absolutely right.

This week I was able to try a Tread 2, and honestly, both the syncing and the map zoom, and everything else, is much faster and smoother than on the XT2. It's clear it has a much more powerful processor. You can move the map with your fingers like a mobile phone without parts of the map getting stuck like the XT2 does. It syncs the same collections 20 times faster than the XT2. As soon as I turned it on, it synced my entire Explore cloud in about 30 seconds.

The XT2 takes a good 10-15 minutes to do the same thing

[jfheath]

Don't get too enthusiastic too quickly about fixed synchronization problems.
Even with the new SW updates, I, at least, have continued to experience significant synchronization issues.
I am using now:
zumo XT2 Version 6.40
Tread App Version 2.12.40

Sometimes, the zumo XT2 and the Tread App get stuck in countless synchronization loops
Just as observed previously

Are you using, or have you used @FrankB's Trip Manager to put your routes onto the XT2 ?

Having worked with Frank to get TM to work with the XT2 we found some solutions that made it work but I discovered some things which I found difficult to explain. Frank found work-arounds and these worked perfectly when I tested them. I use TM, but crucially, I do not allow synchronisation. The reason for this is that the synch process caused my routes to be altered. TM is an excellent tool, but it is doing things in a different way from the synch process - which changes the route points' names and locations and hence calculates a different route.

I'm wondering whether this could be an issue. Do you have any trip files in .System/Trips that could have been created by TM . They are easy to spot - they have names that you can read and understand, rather than numbers. I'm wondering whether these could cause a synch issue, because these are files that Tread doesn’t know about. Delete them and see if it makes a difference to your XT2 forever synching.

Report back please.

I would choose either the Tread synch method or Trip Manager. Not both.
Actually that isn't true - I would not be tempted to use the synch method at all.

I am quite happy with the XT2 now that I use TM - it keeps the route point names and positions, and RUT behaviour and route point removal never an issue. But I do not allow synch.

[proofresistant]

... Are you using, or have you used @FrankB's Trip Manager to put your routes onto the XT2 ? ...

I am trying several scenarios

I also had negative experiences with synchronization problems when I used routes imported exclusively via the Tread app and synchronized them with the XT2.
There are also synchronization problems when I import routes via SD card so that they can later be used in the Tread app.
I also had problems when network access to the Explore website was blocked (smartphone in airplane mode).

With the Tread 2, the behavior is always slightly different, but never really better

The only thing that always works well is importing with @FrankB TripManager
OK, importing via SD card works quite well without Tread App Explore access, but it is significantly slower and more tedious than TM.

Nevertheless, I try to test the new versions when updates are available.
I hope that one day I will be able to transfer routes wirelessly

[Lanso]

Are you using, or have you used @FrankB's Trip Manager to put your routes onto the XT2 ?
---
I am quite happy with the XT2 now that I use TM - it doesn't alter the route names or positions and RUT behaviour and route point removal is no longer an issue. But I do not allow synch.

I get that you're very familiar and highly enjoy TripManager.

But everyone is hopeful with every software update that we don't need TripManager anymore.

[jfheath]

@proofresistant - I was just wondering whether there was a TM created trip file present in .System/Trips.



Gpx files on the Sd card are treated differently from gpx files in internal storage. They are not altered in any way, but they still suffer the same route point modifications when the Tread app is involved and/or when synch with the tread database is involved.

(Gpx files in internal storage files have track data and waypoint data removed from the file)

Being able to drop a file into .System/Trips by BT would be brilliant. You could do it with the gpx files into the gpx folder on the XT1 with the Drive app, but not with the XT2 / Tread unless synchronisation is enabled.

[proofresistant]

@proofresistant - I was just wondering whether there was a TM created trip file present in .System/Trips.

I don't quite understand what you find surprising and what exactly you are referring to.
However, in cases where I specifically observe synchronization problems, I use a fresh system without existing GPX or trip files also.

Gpx files on the Sd card are treated differently from gpx files in internal storage. They are not altered in any way, but they still suffer the same route point modifications when the Tread app is involved and/or when synch with the tread database is involved.

When I import directly to the device, I always do so from the SD card.
But the Tread app synchronization doesn't handle/modify GPX files, or have I overlooked something?
Mainly the shaping points of the routes (trips) that are then in the device and the Tread app are manipulated.

(Gpx files in internal storage files have track data and waypoint data removed from the file)

What do you mean by that?
As far as I know, the GPX files themselves are not changed.
All relevant track and waypoint information is still stored in the .System\trip files and device Explore DB (yes, Waypoint data is also stored in the device's Explore DB).
I don't know what data the Tread app or the Explore page still has and how it is stored. In any case, at least the shaping points with their coordinates are there, even if their positions/coordinates have been changed for some reason.

Being able to drop a file into .System/Trips by BT would be brilliant. You could do it with the gpx files into the gpx folder on the XT1 with the Drive app, but not with the XT2 / Tread unless synchronisation is enabled.

Hope dies last.
I don't understand Garmin. The XT2 and the Tread app have been around for years now, and it's still not possible to transfer data “without problems.”

[jfheath]

@proofresistant - I was just wondering whether there was a TM created trip file present in .System/Trips.

I don't quite understand what you find surprising and what exactly you are referring to.
However, in cases where I specifically observe synchronization problems, I use a fresh system without existing GPX or trip files also.

If that is the case, then it answers the question. Thank you. I'll answer the other part of this in the development pages if you wish. I don't want to get to technical on these pages.

Gpx files on the Sd card are treated differently from gpx files in internal storage. They are not altered in any way, but they still suffer the same route point modifications when the Tread app is involved and/or when synch with the tread database is involved.

When I import directly to the device, I always do so from the SD card.
But the Tread app synchronization doesn't handle/modify GPX files, or have I overlooked something?
Mainly the shaping points of the routes (trips) that are then in the device and the Tread app are manipulated.

Sending to the SD card is the safest method. Data (route point names and locations - particularly shaping points, but sometimes via points) are relocated and renamed:
1) By the Tread App itself on ipad and android phone when creating a route.
2) At some point in the transfer from the remote device (iphone, ipad, android phone) to the Tread database, to the Zumo. I did find out at what point it happened in a few tests. I'd need to look back through notes to be certain.
3) When importing data from a gpx file into the XT2

(Gpx files in internal storage files have track data and waypoint data removed from the file)

What do you mean by that?
As far as I know, the GPX files themselves are not changed.
All relevant track and waypoint information is still stored in the .System\trip files and device Explore DB (yes, Waypoint data is also stored in the device's Explore DB).
I don't know what data the Tread app or the Explore page still has and how it is stored. In any case, at least the shaping points with their coordinates are there, even if their positions/coordinates have been changed for some reason.

If you put a gpx file into internal storage then when the Zumo is booted up after transfer, it seeks out new gpx files and processes them.

• The Waypoints (Those defined as waypoints at the head of the gpx file before the start of the route definition), are read and imported into the Waypoints section of Explore at start-up.
• Tracks are Read and copied into the Tracks section of Explore, but only after selecting a track to import. Any track. It will then import all of them. The hundreds of lines that make up a track between the <trk> and </trk> tags in the gpx file are then deleted from the gpx file. This means that they cannot be imported again if they are deleted using the XT2 menus in the Explore section.
• Waypoints can be selected to import a second time, but a duplicate waypoint is not created in the XT2. The definition remains in the gpx file.
• See app.php/XT2-P338b - and the following page.

Being able to drop a file into .System/Trips by BT would be brilliant. You could do it with the gpx files into the gpx folder on the XT1 with the Drive app, but not with the XT2 / Tread unless synchronisation is enabled.

Hope dies last.
I don't understand Garmin. The XT2 and the Tread app have been around for years now, and it's still not possible to transfer data “without problems.”

Personal opinion only. I don't think that they care a great deal. They seem to be addressing the problems of the majority. And it seems that the majority cannot plot a point on a map, or prefer to use programs from other sources which have different maps. With the technically brilliant Zumo 590 this caused problems - people were complaining because it forever taking them to route points that they had not visited because they were plotted incorrectly.

So instead of producing a manual to help customers do it properly, they cater for the largest area of the customer population normal curve, somewhere to the left of the mean - and make the routing ‘idiot proof’. It gets you to your destination but it doesn’t necessarily follow the roads that you want to ride.

So you plot a point. By default, the XT2 assumes that every point is only approximate- eg that it has been placed by using a different map without zooming in. It seems to use those coordinates and finds a known point close by in a database. And just in case there are a couple of possible roads to choose from it assumes that you want to be on the faster road. So the point changes and the name changes to what was obtained from database.

So I think a lot of effort has gone into this approach because it sells more units. And they don't get many complaints because the majority of people on well known forums seem to advise using tracks to fix the problems. Tracks don’t change. So they then get the Zumo to convert the track to a trip, and they have no problems.

Except: Track-Trips are the reason that we have problems with RUT behaviour. So they turn off automatic recalculation, and that solves that problem. And the majority seem to be happy with that solution and that is perfectly fine.

They seem oblivious to the fact that they have paid £550 for something that is not that far removed from a £2 map book and a highlighter pen.

Which for say a tour operator wanting to share routes with customers, this would be ideal.

Years back, my first look at TomTom led me to believe that they used tracks rather than point to point navigation. Whether or not that impression was accurate, I preferred the point to point method that I saw on Garmin. Take a deviation from the plotted route, the Garmin would find a new way to get you to the next point. That was what I wanted. Garmin seem to have moved from that and for me, it is not for the better. The 590 remains the most reliable navigation device that they have produced, in my opinion. Pity about the screen and battery though.